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  #1  
Old 16 Sep 2009
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Question Turning temporarily imported bike into a "roadworthy" one in NSW - just silly!

We got our Estonian-registered bike imported into Australia (Sydney) under a Carnet just last week and are now trying to figure out how to ride around the country in a lawful way. It seems that one thing that is required in almost the whole country is the Compulsory Third Party insurance (CTP) for bodily injury. Australian Automobile Association's (AAA) web page suggests that it should be provided by the Roads and Transport Authority (RTA). RTA in NSW, however, says that they absolutely do not deal with CTP and that we should address insurance companies instead. Different insurance companies that we've contacted only provide insurance for vehicles that are registered in Australia. We are not intending to register the bike here since we're here on a temporary basis only.
This whole thing is quite confusing, since today we met a biker from Germany (whose bike has German licence plate) who had shipped his bike from Singapore to Darwin, and he said he got his "green slip" (goes for CTP, I suppose) from a motor regisrty in Darwin. Well, it is obvious that different states here have different requirements and that since NSW does not require foreign registered bikes to have any sort of permits or insurance it does not offer one either. But soon we'll get to Queensland and it appears from AAA web page that there one should have insurance to travel on their roads. Also, to get any sort of insurance, companies ask for the number on the "pink slip" (roadworthiness certificate), but those slips are only issued to registered vehicles, and we were directed to go to some place which offers "blue slips" (whatever they are for), but in order to get one, you have to have some sort of approval from Canberra. That does sound too complicated to be reasonable.
Thus, my question is: has anyone ever obtained CTP in NSW, and what steps did you go through to get one?
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  #2  
Old 16 Sep 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Margus View Post
Thus, my question is: has anyone ever obtained CTP in NSW, and what steps did you go through to get one?
For a start I'm an Aussie resident and therefore my bikes CTP is included in my VICTORIAN Rego and it covers me for the whole of Australia.

As a visitor you have to buy CTP in each state you travel to, but it's a PITA.

In Victoria you buy it from VIC Roads - can't remember the technical term for it. In NSW you buy it from one of the NSW insurance providers and I think it's the same in QLD. For the rest of Australia I don't know, but I do know it's a stupid system.

Why they can't have one CTP policy for visiting vehicles and that policy covers all states, is beyond me.
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Last edited by Dave Milligan; 17 Sep 2009 at 10:41. Reason: I can spell but sometimes the brain is in neutral
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  #3  
Old 16 Sep 2009
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I would call NRMA insurance division to see if you can take out a policy without actually having Oz rego. If they will sell you a policy (it's cheap) it will cover you in all states and territories.

You could also call any one of the other insurance companies that offer CTP but NRMA should also be able to advise about the combination of Carnet and Insurance, don't ask the state rego departments - you will inevitably deal with someone either behind a counter or on the phone who has no idea.
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Old 16 Sep 2009
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Hi Margus

You can easily get full insurance from Swann for a foreign vehicle in Oz. No pink slip number required. We just got it with monthly payments then cancelled when we left. Most other insurance companies, including NRMA will not insure foreign vehicles.

We got the Vicroads TAC permit for the time we were in Vic, it was only $30 or so for 2 weeks but if going again I would not bother - It's so hard to find out what is required I am sure the police would have no clue that a TAC is required for foreign vehicles when it isn't needed for out of state ones.

There was also some permit supposedly required for South Aus but the SA transport dept didn't really seem to know the details & suggested that we call into an office when we got there - We decided that if head office in Adelaide didn't know, the office in little Port Augusta probably didn't know, & the SA police definitely wouldn't know so we didn't bother.

Cheers
Clint
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  #5  
Old 17 Sep 2009
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Thanks for that mates.

I'll try that Swann for a starter.
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  #6  
Old 17 Sep 2009
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I'm surprised by your comment that NSW doesn't require foreign vehicles to have third party personal injury insurance.

In NSW (and I imagine it's the same throughout Australia) it's an offence for an unregistered and uninsured (as in CTP) vehicle to use a public road, just as it's an offence for any unlicensed person to drive on a public road.

It seems strange that a foreign vehicle would be exempt from a law that pertains to all local vehicles. Then again we all know the law can be an ass.
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Old 17 Sep 2009
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Hi Margus,

just so you're clear a green slip is another name for CTP insurance (it comes on a green piece of paper) and a pink slip is another name for a roadworthiness certificate or safety check (it used to come on a pink piece of paper but doesn't anymore).

Don't worry about the blue slip. That's a safety check that has to be done if you want to register a vehicle in NSW that has been registered in another state / country. I bought my car with Victorian rego, to get it registered in NSW I had to get a blue slip instead of a pink slip. Nothing to do with Canberra, just went to an authorised blue slip inspection place.

I would also be really surprised if you didn't need CTP to drive in NSW. I'm sure the police would expect you to have CTP too.

The bureaucracy around rego / CTP here is just crazy though. My 4wd is on it's way to Africa at the moment and to keep my NSW rego current I still have to pay for CTP insurance which I'm pretty sure isn't valid outside Aus.
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Old 17 Sep 2009
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Here's the deal - we've called AAA which forwarded us to Royal Automobile Club of Queensland (this is where we're going next), which forwarded us to Queensland Transport Department, which gave us a list of insurance companies that should be able to issue CTP for overseas registered vehicles. All in all, we've spoken to DOZENS of insurance companies (including the beforementioned), and either they know nothing about green slips for overseas registered vehicles, or they say that they only provide insurance for Australian registered vehicles. During four days we've spent hours on the phone trying to figure it out, but the institutions that should know about this thing just keep on forwarding us to someone else.

We only found one company in Queensland which maybe does provide CTP for overseas vehicles, but one can only obtain it in Queensland. But I would not count on that.

It's just unbelievable how nobody in specialized institutions knows anything about handling temporarily imported vehicles and and none can provide us a simple CTP if it's not registered in Australia - fer fox sakes, it covers 3rd party anyway, doesn't matter who crashes into anybody, non-registered or registered vehicle in Australia. Basically it's like asking from insurance company "do you want my money in an easy way?" and ther answer is "no".

Blueslip - we went to a specialized garage that issues blue slips and they said they need a special kind of customs clearance paper from Canberra - nothing else does for them, not even a Carnet (which basically is THE utmost-customs clearance paper). It can't get more silly than that, or it's just NSW?

When it comes to the CTP requirement in NSW, we were told at the RTA that visiting vehicles are exempt from the requirement to have it (since only registered vehicles can get CTP) and that in the case of an accident bodily injury is covered by some sort of scheme (don't remember its name though).
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Old 17 Sep 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Margus View Post
Here's the deal - we've called AAA which forwarded us to Royal Automobile Club of Queensland (this is where we're going next), which forwarded us to Queensland Transport Department, which gave us a list of insurance companies that should be able to issue CTP for overseas registered vehicles. All in all, we've spoken to DOZENS of insurance companies (including the beforementioned), and either they know nothing about green slips for overseas registered vehicles, or they say that they only provide insurance for Australian registered vehicles. During four days we've spent hours on the phone trying to figure it out, but the institutions that should know about this thing just keep on forwarding us to someone else.

We only found one company in Queensland which maybe does provide CTP for overseas vehicles, but one can only obtain it in Queensland. But I would not count on that.

It's just unbelievable how nobody in specialized institutions knows anything about handling temporarily imported vehicles and and none can provide us a simple CTP if it's not registered in Australia - fer fox sakes, it covers 3rd party anyway, doesn't matter who crashes into anybody, non-registered or registered vehicle in Australia. Basically it's like asking from insurance company "do you want my money in an easy way?" and ther answer is "no".

Blueslip - we went to a specialized garage that issues blue slips and they said they need a special kind of customs clearance paper from Canberra - nothing else does for them, not even a Carnet (which basically is THE utmost-customs clearance paper). It can't get more silly than that, or it's just NSW?

When it comes to the CTP requirement in NSW, we were told at the RTA that visiting vehicles are exempt from the requirement to have it (since only registered vehicles can get CTP) and that in the case of an accident bodily injury is covered by some sort of scheme (don't remember its name though).
hi Margus!

we are now in fairbanks, alaska.

what a shame about australia. there are so much things to be done. the new ruling abt carnet gives me a BIG BIG HEADACHE! and now, the insurance thing that you and i have to go thro.

hey, do go so fast! i will be only be in australia in 27nov2009, then to east timor, indonesia, malaysia and singapore. once in singapore, i need to sort out myself and earn more $$$ to host you guys coming over.

so, slow down and i can catch up with you to host you in singapore.

goh
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  #10  
Old 17 Sep 2009
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I am embarrassed that we (as in Oz beauracracy and therefore by default all Oz citizens) have made your quest to do the right thing such a PITA.

Hope you travels are more in keeping with what you expected when you set out to travel our vast brown land, watch out for drop bears they be dangreous little buggers!
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  #11  
Old 17 Sep 2009
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Sorry I don't have any answers to this predicament, but I suspect that part of the problem is that one doesn't see many foreign vehicles in Australia, and many people in the insurance business have probably never had to deal with this issue.

I lived in Australia for all but the last 12 months of my life (i.e. well over 50 years) and the only non-Australian-registered vehicles that I can ever recall seeing on Aussie roads were a few British cars, one NZ car, one Austrian BMW motorcycle and two Californian Harleys.

It seems to me that this may be a problem that needs to be addressed at a political level. Clearly the Australian states need to have a policy that applies throughout the whole country.

On a different tack, is it possible to buy anywhere in the world an insurance policy that covers the requirements of every country on the planet?

(If any of this doesn't make sense, put it down to the fact that I've had a few glasses of good Aussie red tonight)
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Old 18 Sep 2009
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The bureaucracy in NSW around roads / transport is ridiculous. I'm experiencing it in the other direction, taking a NSW vehicle overseas, and I think the point about not many foreign cars / bikes coming here (or leaving) is true. Aus is too far from everywhere else for most people to bother, so bureaucrats just aren't used to dealing with it and it's a classic case of "computer says no".

Regarding worldwide insurance, Campbell Irvine do it but it's in addition to a local policy not instead of. So you buy local 3rd party, then if you want extras like fire and theft or fully comp get that through Campbell Irvine. Nice idea about a worldwide 3rd party though. If it can work in Europe why not elsewhere?
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Old 18 Sep 2009
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Jeez, I feel sorry for you Margus I must have been rather more fortunate, havin entered via Perth Airport. Mind you, the bureaucracy there was hair rising as well, but somehow I managed to get my bike into OZ more easily.

At the airport the first station was the customs, which was no problem with the carnet. After that quarantine dept. Since the bike was well cleaned, no probs either. Third station was the roadworthiness test. The officer wanted to have the whole bike cheked regarding all specifications necessary to register a new vehicle, like measurements, weight, speed etc. etc. So I told him that the data contained in the carnet had to be enough information for him, because this was an international document which ALL countries accept as such. Phew, he accepted that, and only checked the lights and brakes.

Final station was the licensing office to have the bike registered. No, you do not need a local rego, but the vehicle and the foreign rego has to be entered in the computer. All they did was to copy the number plate into the computer and sell me a disc for a third party insurance. This I took as being valid for the whole of OZ.

The only problem I ever had was when returning from Tassie to mainland OZ. That buggar at the ferry entrance tried to argue that the ferry company was not permitted to transport foreign vehicles. I asked him what he thought how the bloody hell I had come to Tassie...?! My god, I always imagined that the bureaucrats where only in Europe, but I had to learn something else...

Good luck mate. Just don't let yourself be talked into buying a local rego. I met a Swiss girl whose english wasn't that good to argue with the officials. They forced her to buy a local rego for +/- 500 AUD.

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Old 27 Sep 2009
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Hi we are curently touring Oz and asked NSW for an answer here is there reply Hope it helps.

Dear Andrew,

Vehicles visiting from overseas must have current overseas
registration and their country of origin number plates fitted.

These vehicles are exempt from NSW registration and are not issued
with an unregistered vehicle permit (UVP).

A vehicle exempt from NSW registration is also exempt from the
requirement to have compulsory third party insurance. A NSW third
party personal injury claim involving a vehicle visiting from
overseas is made against the Nominal Defendant Scheme. This scheme
is administered by the MAA.

If the overseas registration expires while the vehicle is in NSW, the
vehicle must be fully registered in NSW if the owner intends to keep
using the vehicle.

Regards
Col
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Old 27 Sep 2009
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Andrew, that seems to shed some light on the mystery.

Did that advice come from the RTA or someone else in NSW?

And I've heard of the Nominal Defendant but what is the MAA?
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