Also, Lucas CAV fuel pumps do NOT like vegetable oil, Bosch pumps seem to be the best


Trophymick

Oh why does that not surprise me?

Lucas electrics have always been a little hit and miss, why should their pumps be any different?

Could you clarify between vegetable oil and fatty acid methyl ester (biodiesel)? All Euro diesels are required to be able to tolerate at least 5% FAME which has lubricity, combustion and flow characteristics similar to petroleum diesel fuel. Unesterified ("straight") vegetable oil OTOH will gell at about 0-5 C., probably foul electonic injectors and is not recommended for any new diesels. FAME is made by treating veg oil with lye, reacting it with methanol, washing residual glycerol and lye out with acidified water, then making sure all the water is out. Not totally easy in your bathtub.
Vegetable oil vs. FAME ("biodiesel") are totally different substances.

Charlie

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Unimog U500 w/Unicat

That's a bloody good question.

And to be totally honest, you seem to know far more on this subject than I.

All I know is that I run a VW 'PD' DERV engine and the handbook states that you are not to use pump DERV that exceeds a 5% bio content and a mate has a LR TD5 and his handbook states that his engine is not to be given any DERV with any amount of bio content.

The guy I refer to that is running a high veg oil mix in a 300 series engine Disco is using veg oil straight from Tesco with no additives other than an
Not running a motor that is able to cope with veg cooking oil I have not taken too much notice around people that are doing this. I haven't seen the guy with the Disco lately, but when I see him again I'll ask him what he uses and at what mix.

I do remember watching the program 'It's not easy being green' with Dick Strawbridge because they were going to show you how they made bio-diesel. He mackled together an old hot water copper cylinder and immersion and poured wasted chip oil into it with a load of other fluid but the whole process was not shown in full detail and left me wondering why I'd bothered to spend the time watching it. I assume this is the FAME fuel you are talking of.

Even with the relaxation in the duty, using veg oil as a fuel still seems to be an underground activity. I struggle to find much clear information on the alternatives. But it does seem to be a common practice with older mechanical injector pump engines to simply replace an amount of pump DERV with unmolested supermarket veg cooking oil.

Yes....
too much FAME (biodiesel) can be hard on certain seals and tubing, kind of similar to ethanol in a petrol motor. Up to a point (5%, according to Mercedes in their workshop documentation) it's just fine with any of their diesel motors including new ones. The writeup says according to German law pump diesel can be up to 5% FAME without even a sticker on the bowser.
OTOH straight vegetable oil I'd only run in an old totally mechanical non common rail diesel. In hot weather, unless blended with regular petroleum diesel or with a fuel tank heating system. How much is Tesco vegetable oil per liter or per gallon? I gather fuel in the UK is about 0.75 UK pounds/liter, or US$6.00/US gallon? Currently in my area it's about US$2.80/US gal.

Charlie

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Unimog U500 w/Unicat

.... made bio-diesel. He ..... and poured wasted chip oil into it with a load of other fluid .... I assume this is the FAME fuel you are talking of.

I dont think so. This is cleaned-up waste chip oil. A true green recycling solution but one that is too messy for most to get involved with.

As I was told by a bloke at a pump, Biodiesel from a filling station is 95% diesel 5% FAME - but as I discovered at 95% of DERV price in the UK so I only bothered with it once.

I presume this EU-sanctioned biodiesel off the forecourt is considered 'safe' for all modern diesel engines (which are just about all CRD now?) and is why manuals state 5% is OK. I suspect many could take more but as CRDs are a lot more economical that old diesel nails I could live with not running veg in one.

I am just happy to slosh in up to 60% veg oil in my Audi (mid-90s electronic ignition) in the warmer months for long runs and welcome the fact that it is no longer illegal here at up to 2000L a year. It's true though, it does still have an underground aspect to it. I read recently that Herr Diesel who invented the engine designed it to run it on veg oil in agricultural applications. Then petro diesel got in on it and here we are.

Fyi in the UK supermarket veg oil is half the price of DERV which is nearly £1 a litre and which is why we have these threads every once in a while!
One of the other ones is here. http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hub...al-in-uk-28054

Ch

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Adventure Motorcycling Handbook 8 • Morocco Overland 3 • Overlanders Handbook 2 • Twit

I have run my 240GD G wagon on veg oil all summer with no problems slightly harder to start but once its running no problems , Im told a 50/50 mix is fine in the winter
Twodogs

Lads

Over in the old emerald isle we have as you might expect - green diesel instead of Red.

Anytimne I drive outside of Ireland I fill up on the Green stuff and fill any jerry cans I have with green also, - once I get out of Ireland.

The customs boys in the UK or France can't do you if you bought the diesel (and have proof - ie receipt) in Ireland because you're not dodging their tax - you're dodging the tax in Ireland or wherever your coming from.

Why pay tax on diesel in your home country if you're not going to burn it in your country!

Niallo

Niallo,

This may be not that easy. I've read somewhere that the diesel marker lasts in the tank for a very long while, which means that even if you did not use tax-free diesel before leaving the country, it may still be traced a few months after returning home. Will you be able to prove when and where it got into your tank?

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Roman (UK)

Howdy Roman

Have also heard that the dye lasts in the tank. But - an Irish customs officer can't do me for not paying duty on fuel used in another country - say the UK.

Perhaps he could report me to the UK customs man....:confused1:

I'll take the risk and willing to do a Churchill on it anyway!!

Cheers

Niallo
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We shall go on to the end, we shall fight in France, we shall fight on the seas and oceans, we shall fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the air, .........whatever the cost may be, we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender, ............. and to hell with it we'll fight the customs officers!!