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  #1  
Old 27 Dec 2006
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Mixing tyres on a Landy

I have a question regarding tyre set up on my landy. I hope someone can help

On my landy I currently have:

Front tyres

Pirelli Scorpion A/T 235/85R16 tubeless

Back tyres

BFG A/t 235/85R16 tubeless

Two spare (not much tread)

Continetal Conti trac A/T 235/85 R16 tubeless

I have also aquired (thanks Andrew) 5 XZYs tubed tyres of varying tread.

Now what I would like to do is swap the two spares I'm carrying at the moment, with the two best XZYs, which are in a lot better condition than the two spares I'm carrying at the moment. This will not only give me two better spares, but would also enable me to practise repairing with the two tubeless spares.

So, is it advisable to have tubeless as your main tyres and tubed as your spares?

Also, is there a problem with the XZYs being skinny? Are they skinnier than the others? Would this mena I would have to swap both tyres on the axle if I had a problem?

I've read and re-read hundreds of posts here, and have made progress regarding tyres I think. Although I'm still a bit confused regarding what split rims are.

Thanks for the help

Cheers
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  #2  
Old 27 Dec 2006
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Hi Olllie,

Hope you had a good christmas.

I think the most likely problem is going to be differing tyre diameters affecting the transmission in your permanent four wheel drive system. This caveat also applies to tyres of the same type with different levels of tread. I'm not sure how much of a problem it would be in real world situations - maybe others will comment on this. Personally, as a purist I would not mix tyre types - there's also a handling issue here to consider.

PS Found the tubes at my girlgriends place which I promised you and will be posting them off shortly.

Andrew.
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  #3  
Old 27 Dec 2006
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Merry Christmas Andrew!

Hi Thanks for that Andrew.

As you can tell I'm only just sorting this out now. It took me a while to just figure out the whole tubeless/tubed scenario. The other thing I'm unsure of, is how you put a tube in a tubeless tyre, but that seemed a much more advanced question! I'll wait before I graduate from the tyres for dummies class first

Hope you had a good christmas, I've jsut started to be able to move again!

Cheers
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  #4  
Old 27 Dec 2006
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why ?

CornishDeity:
I would suggest once your leaving for the big-trip, go with a whole new set of tyres (six), accomponied with a whole set of the same rims (in good condition). You are investing so much in getting this dream come true, why fiddle with different tyre-systems. In the whole picture it isn't that expensive. It will save you from lots of hassle....
I would go for the BFG A/T 235/85R16 tubeless, like you have now, but that's my opinion, and depends on your plans.

If you are afraid of getting stuck somewhere with three flats (!) which are all beyond repair with a tubeless-repair-kit you can take a few innertubes with you. My expercience: if you have to go from tubeless to tubes, you have to rip the tubeless-valves out, but those can be of a different diameter than those on the innertubes ! (which leaves you with useless tubes or drilling holes in your rims on the roadside).


SPLIT-RIMS:


Picture taken from the Tyrepliers-site, a compact discription on tyre-repairs (tubes and tubeless), which offcourse involves using their typeplier-tool and repair-kit, which btw is really a nice piece of equipment.

BTW: For all I know you cannot go tubeless on standard/normal split-rims.

regards
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Last edited by Sophie-Bart; 27 Dec 2006 at 12:00.
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  #5  
Old 27 Dec 2006
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And for now?

Thanks for that Sophie-Bart. I think for the big trip we are planning on getting a whole new set of tubeless XZYs.

But in the mean time could we go with the set up I've envisaged above. We will be doing a couple fo shake down trips to Portugal and elsewhere, but nothing quite so adventurous as Oz! If I can go with the set up mentioned, then I have some tyres to practise with (i.e. the two spare Contientals), and I think some experience would be great before we go. And I don't want to be wishing for punctures to get the experience!

Thanks again for the help

Cheers
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  #6  
Old 27 Dec 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CornishDeity
Thanks for that Sophie-Bart. I think for the big trip we are planning on getting a whole new set of tubeless XZYs.

But in the mean time could we go with the set up I've envisaged above. We will be doing a couple fo shake down trips to Portugal and elsewhere, but nothing quite so adventurous as Oz! If I can go with the set up mentioned, then I have some tyres to practise with (i.e. the two spare Contientals), and I think some experience would be great before we go. And I don't want to be wishing for punctures to get the experience!

Thanks again for the help

Cheers
Didn't want to sound daft.
I can think of problems like Andrew mentioned : "... think the most likely problem is going to be differing tyre diameters affecting the transmission in your permanent four wheel drive system...". But would't be too concerned about it for short trips and driving offroad. For long trips maybe the 5 XZY's are a nice set-up.
Maybe someone else can be of more help in this tech-department.

[edit]
Just saw you're planning to leave in 2009. That's atleast 2 years of getting practise! Why not go for 4 new tyres (for instance, the BFG's) take one of the old ones you have now as a spare. When your going for the big-one take the best ones as spares.
[/edit]

Happy shake-downs !
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Last edited by Sophie-Bart; 27 Dec 2006 at 12:28.
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  #7  
Old 27 Dec 2006
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Think I'll give it a go

Ok thanks again Bart,

I think I'll give it a go with the two XZYs as spares for when I'm popping round the UK. At the moment getting some practise in is the best thing for me, and this allows that

Cheers
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  #8  
Old 28 Dec 2006
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If you want cheap rims to go with your tyres try Vass ltd in ampthill, bedford who are the MOD's main disposal agent for tyres. they have ex mod rims on the cheap. I always take plenty of tubes as they are cheap and I prefer not to repair them if I can help it, just a personal thing.

on the subject of split rims. the wheel in the piccie above is a split rim, albeit a Toyota one I think looking at the stud pattern. theoretically they make tyre changing easier. rather than the tyre being held on by a lip on the wheel on the front and back, one side is held on by a removable ring. removing this ring allows the tyre to be removed more easily. that is in theory any how!! the hardest bit still is breaking the bead. there are various ways of doing this and doing it successfully is the key to tyre changing. I use a bead breaker I got on ebay which is excellent, just make sure you get one man enough for the job if you go down this route. there are other more heath robinson ways such as driving over the edge of the tyre, jacking the car up on the wheel or resting a piece of wood on the rim and driving up it, none of these are terribly satisfactory.

On a safety note, if you are using split rims of the type in the photo, always reinflate with the steel ring resting against something like a tree or the vehicle. it can slip off and it will kill you. In tyre fitters these types of wheel have to be reinflated inside a cage.

always remove the valve core (a tool to do this costs pence) as it the only way to get enough air out of the tyre to make removal easier, or even possible!

Don't forget to use tyre flaps, I did when I first used tubed tyres and got the worlds supply of punctures!! also try an get commercial grade tubes, they are a lot tougher.

If your going to use your tubed tyres as spares I would use them like a space saver spare, i.e. for a short time and at low speed. mixing them with tubeless tyres of a different tread design on the same axle could give rise to some fairly unpleasant handling characteristics. I think that theoreticall there could be an insurance issue with this. It is on a par with mixing cross plies and radials.

TLC H60
landy 101 ambie/camper
1968 morris minor traveller
http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Captain-Mog...3aFQ3aSTQQtZkm
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Last edited by moggy 1968; 28 Dec 2006 at 18:49.
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Old 28 Dec 2006
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Your Landy has an axle to axle differential so it will compensate for differing tyre diameters .Just don't drive with the diff lock engaged for long periods on a hard surface and you will be ok .
Avoid split rims if you can .
Most tubes will have valves that are compatible with the hole in your wheels .
Carry a couple of tubes when youre doing your overland to the Antipodes because there may be times when you have to repair a tyre and it will prove difficult to seal properly or you may bend a rim slightly so that a seal is impossible ,but the rim is still good enough to get you where you need to go .
Remember this a Land Rover and not a highly sophisticated performance car and will "get you there " with whatever wheel and tyre combination you care to chuck on it , you will just have to adjust your driving technique to compensate - that's all .
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Old 28 Dec 2006
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WOW - Thanks Moggy and Dodger!

Wicked. Great info thanks guys. I'm a bit too knackered to take it all in now, but will have a long read through tomorrow.

We're just back from losing our off road cherry, having undertaken a full days course! Brilliant. Although the engine has taken to not turning off when we remove the key! Luckily during my driving lessons stalling was the manouevre that I practised the most!

Again thanks for the tonnes of information. Really really helpful

Brrrm Brrm!
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Old 28 Dec 2006
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dodger - why avoid split rims?
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Old 29 Dec 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moggy 1968
dodger - why avoid split rims?
IMHO they are complicated and dangerous for a novice to meddle with.
I don't think any are available for the later Landies [ but I have been known to be wrong !]
We used to use them on Trials machines to get the offset we needed for a better turning circle on Series One Landies - knicked them off milk floats if I recall correctly .

I reckon just about anybody can lever a 235- 16 off a rim without any trouble if they know what they are doing .
Also a good way to break beads is to use two short pieces [say 6 to 8 inches long ] of 2 1/2 inch angle iron and a sledge hammer - never been known to fail !

Another tip about tyres for heavy laden vehicles is to seek out tyres with strong side walls and keep the pressures up , damaged sidewalls are commonplace if you are going off the beaten track .
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Old 29 Dec 2006
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most things are easy if you know what you are doing!! I find split rims easier 'in the field' for a relative novice like myself, the only time they are dangerous is during reinflation, hence the caveat above. stronger sidewalls will also help when having to run at low pressures in sand, helping keep the tyre on the rim (I think they stay on better on split rims as well!) interestingly (or not!!) the army runs it's michelins at about 45 psi on the rear.
according to the guy at vass, check the tyres occassionally as the blocks can seperate from the tyre base.

A good way to learn about changing tyres (the way I learned) is when you get them fitted talk to the fitter, most will be glad to educate you if they find out what you are attempting. watching a third world tyre fitter is also quite an education!
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Old 30 Dec 2006
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Yeah moggy I think you are right about asking tyre fitters for advice BUT some of the younger guys may be so used to tyre fitting machines that they would be stumped if they had to do it out in the field .
This is where the third world guys would have the edge ,they have to use their ingenuity and make do with what's to hand .
Something I hadn't thought of before would be to use one of those screw actuated bead breakers to bust the bead and then repair the tyre leaving the wheel on the vehicle using a patch/plug .

Another thing I always do is to retorque the wheel nuts after say 50 miles or so with a socket and extended bar . Air torque wrenches don't always work correctly .
Use copper coat or grease on the wheel studs and you'll never have problems undoing wheel nuts , protect any exposed threads with a short length of rubber hose .[ This works well for U bolts on leaf springs and means that the U bolts can be used again - very important for repairs in the bush ]
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Old 30 Dec 2006
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would agree with you there, it's probably like trying to find someone who can set up a twin carb! a commercial fitter would be better as lorry tyres are still done by hand but the africans are the ones to watch!!

I've got a screw bead breaker and it is excellent. I got it second hand on ebay.

As I was mid way through my 360 spin on the autobahn, watching my own wheel coming towards me with the oncoming traffic. I was reminded that I needed to check my nuts more often after a puncture!!
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